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Politics And Controversy Want to talk about something that could turn political or controversial? This is the place to do it.


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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 09-06-2007, 12:28 AM
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OK.... I don't know if you're being sarcastic but assuming you're not:

You want to talk about "reckless statements"? How about when I post a link to an article on MUSLIM destruction of cultural artifacts taking place right now in Israel and then you conclude that my skepticism of the statement that "Islam is a religion of peace" is motivated by my being Jewish??????

For the record, (and Clone 9 can back me upon this one) my ancestors were English, German and a little bit of Cherokee Indian on my mom's side. I don't know of any jewish ancestors. Furthermore, I raised in an evangelical CHRISTIAN environment. I am currently agnostic in that I believe in god but don't think any of the religions have it right. The point being I'm a WASP for god's sake. Hell until I was like 35 I pronounced Chanukah as starting with a ch sound!!!!!

I haven't been "taught to hate muslims since I was little". In fact I was taught the opposite. I believed that they were mistaken but I was taught that people are people and as a "christian" you had to love them regardless. For the longest time I believed that all religions were equally wrong and thus equal. It was an easy way to think. No gray area. Only black and white. But then you begin to notice that the data doesn't support that conclusion. Sure they are all wrong but some are more wrong than others. Some are blowing people and shit up. Some are declaring "convert to our way or die". Some not only justify but PRAISE the killing of women and children in pizza parlors. Sure the christians may be ignorant when it comes to blue laws (can't buy beer on Sunday) but for crying out loud the muslims are HACKING PEOPLE TO DEATH WITH MACHETES!!! THERE IS A DIFFERENCE!!!!

I sincerely believe there are good muslims. I've known some. But I also just as sincerely believe that there are a large number (at least 100,000,000) radicals and the "moderates" who outnumber the radicals have allowed their religion to be hijacked by the radicals. The radicals have said repeatedly, and I believe them because they've done it repeatedly, that they will die to kill us. It is either us or them. When one fights a war there are ALWAYS civilian casualties. And it is the "moderates" who will be the majority of those casualties so they'd better take back their religion or we will at some point have to destroy it.

It's not a joke. It's not sarcasm. And it certainly isn't a result of my "jewish heritage"!!!!

Last edited by wilthrill; 09-06-2007 at 12:33 AM.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 09-07-2007, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikael View Post
Yes, Wil, you're right about Darfur. And look at the swift reaction of the "civilized" world to stop those killings (sarcasm here).
The PC "civilized world" is probably afraid of being seen as "persecuting" the Muslims of Sudan. After all, as has been proposed by Whoopi in the Michael Vick case, it's "a cultural thing", right?
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Old 09-07-2007, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Lerxstcat View Post
The PC "civilized world" is probably afraid of being seen as "persecuting" the Muslims of Sudan. After all, as has been proposed by Whoopi in the Michael Vick case, it's "a cultural thing", right?
Well, the situation in Sudan is Muslim on Muslim violence. The persecution is against the Muslims who are not "Arab" i.e. black, by the Arab Muslims. It's really more of a racial thing.
Don't get me wrong, there are some evil radical fascist Muslims out there, and I'm all for stopping them. I just don't agree that all Muslims think like that.
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Old 09-07-2007, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Mikael View Post
Well, the situation in Sudan is Muslim on Muslim violence. The persecution is against the Muslims who are not "Arab" i.e. black, by the Arab Muslims. It's really more of a racial thing.
Don't get me wrong, there are some evil radical fascist Muslims out there, and I'm all for stopping them. I just don't agree that all Muslims think like that.
My understanding is that the blacks aren't Muslim but are either of ancient tribal religions, or some are Christians. Maybe some are Muslims as well but all I've heard was that it IS religious as well as racial.

Edit: Okay, that was the Sudanese Civil War between the northern and southern regions of the Sudan that I was thinking of. My mistake.

Last edited by Lerxstcat; 09-07-2007 at 05:18 PM.
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Old 09-08-2007, 03:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Lerxstcat View Post
My understanding is that the blacks aren't Muslim but are either of ancient tribal religions, or some are Christians. Maybe some are Muslims as well but all I've heard was that it IS religious as well as racial.

Edit: Okay, that was the Sudanese Civil War between the northern and southern regions of the Sudan that I was thinking of. My mistake.
Some African blacks are Christians. Ethiopia has a long Christian history.
But back to Sudan, it's mostly racial and political.
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Old 09-08-2007, 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Mikael View Post
Some African blacks are Christians. Ethiopia has a long Christian history.
But back to Sudan, it's mostly racial and political.
Yes, the Coptic Church! I know an Egyptian girl whose family are Coptic Christians; their family are actually ethnic Arabs but Christians, interestingly. Amazing that Christianity managed to hold on in that region with the advance of Islam.

I wonder what the Black Muslims of Farrakhan think of Darfur? Kind of blows the myth of Islamic brotherhood, doesn't it?
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Old 09-10-2007, 10:44 AM
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Well it IS both christians and muslims being killed by the muslims in Darfur.

You can debate about tree number 4 in row 5486 but you are missing the forest for the trees when you do so.

The POINT is that NO OTHER MAJOR RELIGION (even those pentecostals who scare the beejesus out of you) is killing literally hundreds of thousands of people who won't convert or don't convert enough(muslim on muslim).

And that is WHY I have a problem with Islam.
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Old 09-10-2007, 10:53 AM
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And again I note that NONE of you defenders of the religion of peace will answer my hypothetical about Christian Identity.

For the record once again, Christian Identity is the religion of the white supremacists. They believe that the Aryans are the true "god's people" and all others (even jews) are mud people and should be treated as such.

So....

Should we "accomodate" christian identity?

Perhaps I should be allowed to start a taxpayer funded school like the muslims in New York City did that accommodates Christian Identity "heritage".

So will one of you defenders of the faith tell me why we should treat Islamic extremists any different than their facist white counterparts?
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 09-10-2007, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilthrill View Post
Well it IS both christians and muslims being killed by the muslims in Darfur.

You can debate about tree number 4 in row 5486 but you are missing the forest for the trees when you do so.

The POINT is that NO OTHER MAJOR RELIGION (even those pentecostals who scare the beejesus out of you) is killing literally hundreds of thousands of people who won't convert or don't convert enough(muslim on muslim).

And that is WHY I have a problem with Islam.

well this is my point here will.....only one group is saying convert or die right now....but these african pentacostals are showing the signs of future killers.....this is the exact same thing that extremist muslims did in the past (i.e. destroying religious icons et al) and for a long time the spanish christians were doing the same thing. so i see a pattern here. and the secondary pattern is that noone will do anything until were in the situation that were currently in now
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Old 09-10-2007, 07:09 PM
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Well even if you are right and the pentecostals are "showing signs of future killers" why are you so worried about that when we have PRESENT DAY killers (aka muslims) doing their dirty work in plain sight???

I'm not trying to pick on your junkernaut, but I hear so many of the same people who are so quick to castigate christians for ANYTHING and yet insist that we treat Islam as a "religion of peace".

They, for example will criticize christians as being "intolerant" when christians have the nerve to object to being forced through taxes to subsidize such "art" as the Mother Mary smeared in shit or a crucifix in urine.

When 10,000 muslims KILL people and blow up shit over a danish cartoon these SAME EXACT PEOPLE tell us that WE (those who disapprove of MURDER) are intolerant and must "understand" the muslim rage.

And BTW what did you think of the muslims destroying artifacts from Solomon's temple? I posted a link to it.
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